From sc-users-owner Fri Jul 25 18:21:29 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id SAA17416 for sc-users-outgoing; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:20:20 -0500 (CDT) Received: from mail.eclipse.net (mail.eclipse.net [207.207.192.13]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id SAA17654 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 18:20:07 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [207.207.200.154] (so1-154.eclipse.net [207.207.200.154]) by mail.eclipse.net (8.8.6/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA23951 for ; Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:20:06 -0400 (EDT) X-Sender: kmistove@mail.eclipse.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 19:24:17 -0400 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: Ken Mistove <---@---.---> Subject: Be Port? Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users Hi, James, how is the SC port to BeOs going? Now that the BeOS preview release is available, I can't wait to see SC on my PowerMac running under Be. I just installed the OS and it's working fine (fingers are crossed). Ken From sc-users-owner Sat Jul 26 10:27:21 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id KAA32678 for sc-users-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:27:08 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ds1.gl.umbc.edu (ds1.gl.umbc.edu [130.85.3.11]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id KAA32672 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 10:26:54 -0500 (CDT) Received: from umbc10.umbc.edu (dcrand1@umbc10.umbc.edu [130.85.3.14]) by ds1.gl.umbc.edu (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA15492 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:26:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (dcrand1@localhost) by umbc10.umbc.edu (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA26048 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:26:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: umbc10.umbc.edu: dcrand1 owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 11:26:52 -0400 (EDT) From: David Crandall <---@---.---> X-Sender: dcrand1@umbc10.umbc.edu To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net Subject: Re: Be Port? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Ken Mistove wrote: > James, how is the SC port to BeOs going? Now that the BeOS preview release > is available, I can't wait to see SC on my PowerMac running under Be. I > just installed the OS and it's working fine (fingers are crossed). If anyone would care to reply (directly, if it seems more appropriate) with resource pointers or accounts of the advantages of using BeOS including sound apps that happen there, I'm curious. I'm running a PM 7600/132. thanks, David Crandall Graduate Student, Imaging and Digital Arts, University of Maryland, Baltimore County Sound Designer Clean Cuts Music dcrand1@gl.umbc.edu From sc-users-owner Sat Jul 26 12:06:21 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id MAA25264 for sc-users-outgoing; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:06:04 -0500 (CDT) Received: from clyde.as.utexas.edu (clyde.as.utexas.edu [128.83.129.156]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id MAA25246 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:05:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [128.83.176.186] (slip-105-42.ots.utexas.edu) by clyde.as.utexas.edu (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA13451; Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:07:43 -0500 X-Sender: james@clyde.as.utexas.edu (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 12:13:22 -0700 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: James McCartney <---@---.---> Subject: Re: Be Port? Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users At 8:26 AM -0700 7/26/97, David Crandall wrote: >On Fri, 25 Jul 1997, Ken Mistove wrote: > >> James, how is the SC port to BeOs going? Now that the BeOS preview release >> is available, I can't wait to see SC on my PowerMac running under Be. I >> just installed the OS and it's working fine (fingers are crossed). > >If anyone would care to reply (directly, if it seems more appropriate) >with resource pointers or accounts of the advantages of using BeOS >including sound apps that happen there, I'm curious. I'm running a PM >7600/132. The work on a new version continues. I will come out with the Mac version first, since that is what everyone is running now. Perhaps there will be a preliminary version available sometime in September, we'll see. I'd like to have something ready before ICMC, even though I'm not giving any paper there. A Be port will be pretty straight forward, the new version is much more portable. I want to do the Be version for the dual CPU UMAX S900 I won at the Be Masters Awards (URL w/screenshot of the BeOS program I wrote below), so it will happen. http://www.be.com/developers/masters/masters_may97/index.html As far as the advantages of BeOS for SC in particular: Prioritized preemptive multithreading is very important. The only way to get anything real-time under MacOS is to do things at interrupt level. This means no memory allocation, no drawing to the screen, etc. There is no such limitation on BeOS. This will make more things possible to do on the BeOS. The Sound Manager on MacOS is a messy API -- lots of setting values in structures, no real coordination between sound input and output (its really two different APIs). The BeOS sound API is much better. The BeOS can more readily take advantage of multiple CPUs. SC has a problem in that there is no good multithreaded real time garbage collector which would be required to fully multithread the virtual machine. Therefore audio processing in SC will only be possible on one CPU. However all the sound I/O and graphics operations can be scheduled on other CPUs, so there is still an advantage. You would also be able to run more than one copy of SC under BeOS to better use the other CPUs. Once Rhapsody gets here I will consider a port to that as well. MacOS is a real straightjacket for SC. --- james mccartney james@clyde.as.utexas.edu james@lcsaudio.com If you have a PowerMac check out SuperCollider, a real time synth program: ftp://mirror.apple.com//mirrors/Info-Mac.Archive/gst/snd/super-collider-demo.hqx From sc-users-owner Sun Jul 27 09:30:05 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id JAA22440 for sc-users-outgoing; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 09:29:36 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ds1.gl.umbc.edu (ds1.gl.umbc.edu [130.85.3.11]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id JAA29592 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 09:29:16 -0500 (CDT) Received: from umbc10.umbc.edu (dcrand1@umbc10.umbc.edu [130.85.3.14]) by ds1.gl.umbc.edu (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA25164 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 10:29:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (dcrand1@localhost) by umbc10.umbc.edu (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA04225 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 1997 10:29:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: umbc10.umbc.edu: dcrand1 owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 10:29:15 -0400 (EDT) From: David Crandall <---@---.---> X-Sender: dcrand1@umbc10.umbc.edu To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net Subject: Re: Be Port? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users Thanks for the quick reply. Now I can get a headstart on yearning for Be versions of Max and Pro Tools (sigh).. Quick followup. I can always use hotbot to find general Be info; any good pointers to sites, articles, etc. on other Be software for audio, MIDI, video...? thanks again, David Crandall Graduate Student, Imaging and Digital Arts, University of Maryland, Baltimore County Sound Designer Clean Cuts Music dcrand1@gl.umbc.edu From sc-users-owner Tue Jul 29 14:21:29 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id OAA13456 for sc-users-outgoing; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 14:19:11 -0500 (CDT) Received: from zoom.bga.com (zoom.realtime.net [205.238.128.40]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id OAA28034 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 14:18:53 -0500 (CDT) Received: from tango.create.ucsb.edu (create.ucsb.edu [128.111.92.40]) by zoom.bga.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA19061 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 14:18:52 -0500 Received: by tango.create.ucsb.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA09330; Tue, 29 Jul 97 11:51:31 PDT From: stp@create.ucsb.edu (Stephen Travis Pope) Message-Id: <9707291851.AA09330@tango.create.ucsb.edu> Date: Tuesday, 29 Jul 97 12:18:54 pm Subject: "Sound and Music Processing in SuperCollider"--A Tutorial To: sc-users@bga.com Cc: icma@umich.edu Fonts: 1345 1 Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users Hello all, I have placed PDF files of the revised *draft* of my SuperCollider tutorial "Sound and Music Processing in SuperCollider" on the CREATE Web site for comments and corrections. Your input is invited. It is my intention to update this to the new language syntax as soon as I get a copy of the new compiler. Location URL = ftp://ftp.create.ucsb.edu/pub/SuperCollider/ Format There are two parts to the file: SuperColliderBook.sit.hqx.1 and 2. These need to be joined using StuffIt, then un-BinHexed, then un-Stuffed. This will result in 3 PDF files for the cover, table of contents, and book body. (I'll put the PDF files up there directly in a few days.) The PDF files are best when printed (or copied) double-sided. Intended Audience The tutorial is intended for readers who already know some music synthesis (or general-purpose) programming language. We used it at CREATE in Curtis Roads' class together with his "The Computer Music tutorial" (MIT Press, 1996) and James McCartney's "SuperCollider Reference Manual." The SuperCollider tutorial does not introduce general programming concepts, nor the technology of sound synthesis. Disclaimers This is a DRAFT. I would very much appreciate feedback, corrections, additional examples, helpful hints, etc. I am not a graphic designer, so the current look is a bit plain. stp _ Stephen Travis Pope, stp@create.ucsb.edu, http://www.create.ucsb.edu/~stp/ _ Center for Research in Electronic Art Technology (CREATE) _ Dept. of Music, U. C. Santa Barbara From sc-users-owner Tue Jul 29 19:01:24 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id TAA27914 for sc-users-outgoing; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 19:01:16 -0500 (CDT) Received: from december.real.net.au (december.real.net.au [203.25.56.1]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id TAA19934 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 19:00:59 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [203.17.243.79] (syd-pm1-14.real.net.au [203.17.243.79]) by december.real.net.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA21413 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 1997 10:00:55 +1000 X-Sender: mogambo@real.net.au (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 10:00:57 +1000 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: mogambo@real.net.au (Arne Hanna) Subject: Re: "Sound and Music Processing in SuperCollider"--A Tutorial Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users Hi Stephen. I've dowloaded the SC tutorial, but Stuffit will not recognise the two segmented files under the Join option. After selecting the two files and Expanding them, I have a folder with 4 files: Cover.pdf README SC.Book3.pdf and T.O.Contents.pdf. These need further decoding but the files are not recognizable by Stuffit as Binhex. Forgive my ignorance, but what is a pdf file? Cheers Arne "It crawled into my hand. Honest!" The Fugs From sc-users-owner Tue Jul 29 20:09:47 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id UAA13798 for sc-users-outgoing; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 20:09:30 -0500 (CDT) Received: from mailhub.dartmouth.edu (mailhub.dartmouth.edu [129.170.16.6]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id UAA26584 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 20:09:07 -0500 (CDT) Received: from cupid.Dartmouth.EDU (cupid.dartmouth.edu [129.170.208.8]) by mailhub.dartmouth.edu (8.8.5+DND/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA16147 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 1997 21:09:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-id: <36713081@cupid.Dartmouth.EDU> Date: 29 Jul 97 21:09:06 EDT From: Kevin.P.Parks@Dartmouth.EDU (Kevin P. Parks) Subject: Re: "Sound and Music Processing in SuperCollider"--A Tutorial To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users --- You wrote: what is a pdf file? --- end of quote --- it is a format for viewing and printing documents. You need adobe acrobat reader to view or print .pdf files. It is free and available from www.adobe.com. -kevin parks From sc-users-owner Thu Jul 31 08:06:12 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id IAA31914 for sc-users-outgoing; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 08:04:45 -0500 (CDT) Received: from december.real.net.au (december.real.net.au [203.25.56.1]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id IAA12166 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 08:04:15 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [203.17.243.94] (syd-pm1-29.real.net.au [203.17.243.94]) by december.real.net.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA01596 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 23:04:05 +1000 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 31 Jul 1997 23:04:07 +1000 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: mogambo@real.net.au (Arne Hanna) Subject: Tutorial.page 59 Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users G'day fellow SC users. Has anyone experienced problems trying to compile the example on page 59 of Stephen Popes' Tutorial? defaudioout L R; deftable table1, env1; start{ [0.00, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 48, 0.5].sched; [0.25, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 50, 0.5].sched; [0.50, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 52, 0.5].sched; [0.75, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 53, 0.5].sched; [1.00, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 55, 0.5].sched; } chorus_instr{ arg dur, pitch, amp; osc = Acoscili(table1, pitch.midicps, 2); amp = Ktransient(env1, dur, amp, 0, `dspRemove); {(osc.value *! amp.value).out(L).out(R)}.dspAdd; } I get: compiling.. *error: parse error on line 18 char 13 : "{" chorus_instr{* *error: parse failed Anyone? Cheers Arne "You people have been throwing shit at me for years. Now it's starting to fertilize" Edgar Varese From sc-users-owner Thu Jul 31 08:45:33 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id IAA11476 for sc-users-outgoing; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 08:45:21 -0500 (CDT) Received: from clyde.as.utexas.edu (clyde.as.utexas.edu [128.83.129.156]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id IAA11470 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 08:45:05 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [128.83.176.101] (slip-104-5.ots.utexas.edu) by clyde.as.utexas.edu (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA04336; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 08:47:07 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 31 Jul 1997 08:52:58 -0700 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: James McCartney <---@---.---> Subject: Re: Tutorial.page 59 Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users At 6:04 AM -0700 7/31/97, Arne Hanna wrote: >G'day fellow SC users. Has anyone experienced problems trying to compile >the example on page 59 of Stephen Popes' Tutorial? > >defaudioout L R; >deftable table1, env1; > >start{ > > [0.00, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 48, 0.5].sched; > [0.25, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 50, 0.5].sched; > [0.50, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 52, 0.5].sched; > [0.75, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 53, 0.5].sched; > [1.00, 'chorus_instr, 0.25, 55, 0.5].sched; > } The back quote is changed to a quote above. It should be: `chorus_instr --- james mccartney james@clyde.as.utexas.edu james@lcsaudio.com If you have a PowerMac check out SuperCollider, a real time synth program: ftp://mirror.apple.com//mirrors/Info-Mac.Archive/gst/snd/super-collider-demo.hqx From sc-users-owner Thu Jul 31 11:31:09 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id LAA27982 for sc-users-outgoing; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 11:30:57 -0500 (CDT) Received: from december.real.net.au (december.real.net.au [203.25.56.1]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id LAA32072 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 11:30:44 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [203.17.243.75] (syd-pm1-10.real.net.au [203.17.243.75]) by december.real.net.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA05189 for ; Fri, 1 Aug 1997 02:30:40 +1000 X-Sender: mogambo@real.net.au (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 1 Aug 1997 02:30:41 +1000 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: mogambo@real.net.au (Arne Hanna) Subject: Re: Tutorial.page 59 Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users James replied: >The back quote is changed to a quote above. >It should be: > > `chorus_instr Nope. That doesn't work either. illegal input string "*" on line 20 *error: parse error on line 20 char 20 : "*" Cheers Arne "You people have been throwing shit at me for years. Now it's starting to fertilize" Edgar Varese From sc-users-owner Thu Jul 31 12:11:43 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id MAA26202 for sc-users-outgoing; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 12:11:29 -0500 (CDT) Received: from clyde.as.utexas.edu (clyde.as.utexas.edu [128.83.129.156]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id MAA26188 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 12:11:11 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [128.83.177.184] (slip-109-40.ots.utexas.edu) by clyde.as.utexas.edu (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA04909; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 12:13:06 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 31 Jul 1997 12:18:57 -0700 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: James McCartney <---@---.---> Subject: Re: Tutorial.page 59 Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users At 9:30 AM -0700 7/31/97, Arne Hanna wrote: >James replied: > >>The back quote is changed to a quote above. >>It should be: >> >> `chorus_instr > >Nope. That doesn't work either. > >illegal input string "*" on line 20 > >*error: parse error on line 20 char 20 : "*" Compiles just fine for me. defaudioout L R; deftable table1, env1; start{ [0.00, `chorus_instr, 0.25, 48, 0.5].sched; [0.25, `chorus_instr, 0.25, 50, 0.5].sched; [0.50, `chorus_instr, 0.25, 52, 0.5].sched; [0.75, `chorus_instr, 0.25, 53, 0.5].sched; [1.00, `chorus_instr, 0.25, 55, 0.5].sched; } chorus_instr{ arg dur, pitch, amp; osc = Acoscili(table1, pitch.midicps, 2); amp = Ktransient(env1, dur, amp, 0, `dspRemove); {(osc.value *! amp.value).out(L).out(R)}.dspAdd; } --- james mccartney james@clyde.as.utexas.edu james@lcsaudio.com If you have a PowerMac check out SuperCollider, a real time synth program: ftp://mirror.apple.com//mirrors/Info-Mac.Archive/gst/snd/super-collider-demo.hqx From sc-users-owner Thu Jul 31 19:07:50 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id TAA37606 for sc-users-outgoing; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 19:07:37 -0500 (CDT) Received: from pixar.com (pixar.pixar.com [138.72.10.20]) by mail2.realtime.net (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id TAA37074 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 19:07:18 -0500 (CDT) Received: from cliff.pixar.com by pixar.com with SMTP id AA12020 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for sc-users@lists.realtime.net); Thu, 31 Jul 1997 17:07:17 -0700 Received: from [138.72.25.187] by cliff.pixar.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA07806; Thu, 31 Jul 1997 17:07:14 -0700 X-Sender: alex@cliff.pixar.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 31 Jul 1997 17:07:15 -0700 To: sc-users@lists.realtime.net From: Alex Stahl <---@---.---> Subject: Re: "Sound and Music Processing in SuperCollider"--A Tutorial Sender: owner-sc-users@lists.realtime.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sc-users I had similar problems with Stuffit Expander (damaged data forks and incompatible optimizer errors) until I got a more recent version of "Drop Stuff with Expander Enhancer" from ftp://mirror.apple.com/mirrors/info-mac/_Compress_%26_Translate/drop-stuff-with- ee-40.hqx pdf = portable document format. Use Acrobat Reader from ftp://ftp.adobe.com/pub/adobe/acrobatreader -Alex >Hi Stephen. I've dowloaded the SC tutorial, but Stuffit will not recognise >the two segmented files under the Join option. After selecting the two >files and Expanding them, I have a folder with 4 files: Cover.pdf README >SC.Book3.pdf and T.O.Contents.pdf. These need further decoding but the >files are not recognizable by Stuffit as Binhex. Forgive my ignorance, but >what is a pdf file? >Cheers >Arne >